Phantom's Temple

The Temple => The Heart Room => Topic started by: The Viper on December 21, 2011, 05:46:05 PM

Title: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on December 21, 2011, 05:46:05 PM
I've been watching some temple runs, and wondering if there could have been alternative routes to reach the artifact. Does anyone have any possibilities?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Ancient Warrior on December 21, 2011, 06:42:15 PM
Well, for starters, I think most of the teams that met three Temple Guards had an alternative that would've cut at least one of them out.  For example, both the Iguanas in "The Useless Map of the Chibcha Chieftain" and the Snakes in "The Pendant of Kamehameha" could have taken the high road out of the Pit.  There had to be alternatives for them, at least, considering that each of those teams only had one Pendant.

I'm definitely left wondering about a lot of Season 1 runs, since the number of actuator rooms keeps us from getting to see just how many doors could be opened.  I have a theory about "The Moccasins of Geronimo" that it would've been possible to continue "left" from the Treasure Room, but the Shrine would probably have a Temple Guard and the players would then have had to enter the Dungeon and climb up.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on December 22, 2011, 01:07:25 AM
Here is a list of episodes that had alternate choices the players could take:

The Pendant of Kamehameha - When Tina spins the sundial in the Observatory, the door from the Wall Climb opens. Had the team went directly to this room, then it would've been a successful solo run.

The Stolen Arm of Shiva - In the Observatory when the second runner spins the sundial, you will notice the bar leading to the Trouble Bridge opens, indicating they could've avoided the entire central shaft.

The Silver Saddle Horn of Hannibal - Its very much likely that the Troubled Bridge would've opened in this run, indicated by the fact that the frontrunner was able to enter all the rooms on the top floor. Had she stayed on the bottom the entire time, this would've been successful.

Pecos Bill's Lost Lariat - When Colleen spins the celestial lights, you will notice that the Treasure Room directly opens and that she could've avoided the Heart Room guard.

King Tut's Cobra Staff - Considering that Eusinia was able to retreat back to the Wheel Room from the Throne Room, I guarantee that this team would've been able to start in the Wheel Room also.

The Electrified Key of Benjamin Franklin - Peter could've avoided Medusa's Lair temple guard easily if he went into the Observatory.

The Snow Cone of Mount Kilimanjaro - I don't really remember because I hate this run, but I am pretty sure that the King's Storeroom opened from the Pit of the Pendulum.

The Broken Trident of Poseidon - When Kimberly knocks the stone column down in the Pit, you will notice the King's Storeroom door opens at the top of the central shaft. Its very likely that if she went to the top of the central shaft, that is the location of the temple guards she never encounters.

There are probably a bunch of episodes I am overlooking too.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Silver Monkey on December 22, 2011, 01:35:28 AM
The Electrified Key of Benjamin Franklin - Peter could've avoided Medusa's Lair temple guard easily if he went into the Observatory.

He entered Medusa's Lair from the Observatory. However, the door to the Storeroom did open when he completed the stone column, so he still could've avoided Medusa's Lair's guard, anyway. And to think that if he did, we would've had a bottom of the central shaft victory. :(
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot319 on December 22, 2011, 08:36:07 AM
I think The Lucky Medallion of Atocha had another route. Ty could've chosen the bottom route and the other two temple guards were down there. Another thing is that I don't think the wall could be broken from the Dark Forest.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on December 22, 2011, 11:27:20 AM
The Electrified Key of Benjamin Franklin - Peter could've avoided Medusa's Lair temple guard easily if he went into the Observatory.

He entered Medusa's Lair from the Observatory. However, the door to the Storeroom did open when he completed the stone column, so he still could've avoided Medusa's Lair's guard, anyway. And to think that if he did, we would've had a bottom of the central shaft victory. :(

That was a common theme in all the bottom of the central shaft runs. The contestants make stupid mistakes that cost them a win. A lot of those runs were close (except Elizabeth I's Golden Ship).

I think The Lucky Medallion of Atocha had another route. Ty could've chosen the bottom route and the other two temple guards were down there. Another thing is that I don't think the wall could be broken from the Dark Forest.

If that was the case, then this run would've ended in triple capture assuming he started in the Ledges. But I am glad that he didn't take the direct path to the artifact and this would be a perfect example of how not taking the direct path would benefit the team.

I wonder if "The Mush Pot Hat of Johnny Appleseed" had an alternate path on the bottom floor. I am pretty sure the Dark Forest opened from the Shrine when Angela completed the monkey. If this was the case, the Orange Iguanas would've had more time I assume to reach the Mush Pot Hat.

I also wonder if the Red Jaguars had top floor access in "The Keys to the Alhambra" and could've avoided the bottom floor altogether. Unfortunately, Lisa was stupid so we will never know.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Green Monkey Warrior on December 24, 2011, 09:27:09 PM
A few more episodes with alternate routes:

The Crown of Queen Nzinga: In the Laser Light Room, you can see Medusa's Lair open— indicating that Benjamin and Renee could've avoided the Swamp and Dark Forest guards by going up the central shaft and the two rooms just left of it.

The Pearl Necklace of Gwalior: Something everyone notices about this run is that Ryan and Dawn only had one choice in their run— up to the Crypt or down to the Ledges. If Ryan went down to the Ledges, the path would be very similar to the Imperial Purple Robe of Empress Theodora.

Robin Hood and Marian's Ladder ( :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:): As PP319 said in one of the newer topics, the Treasure Chest would've worked and they would've had to climb down to the Holes and Python and follow the bottom floor— it's likely they would encounter the third guard in possibly one of the three bottom rooms left of the central shaft.

Pecos Bill's Lost Lariat: After how THK located the half-pendant in the Throne Room (which was visible when Chris was leaving through the bottom floor), I realized that there was an alternate route Colleen and Chris could've taken to get to the Lariat— they'd go along the bottom floor up until the Holes of Python (where the Tomb of the Ancient Kings would be locked) and climb up into the Treasure Room from there.

There are more several runs that I'll look over to see if they incorporated alternate routes.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on December 24, 2011, 09:32:35 PM
GMW, I don't understand your comparison of "The Pearl Necklace of Gwalior" with "The Imperial Purple Robe of Empress Theodora". Are you saying that if Ryan started in the Ledges, then the team would've taken the bottom route to the temple? I thought for sure the Tomb of the Headless Kings did not open from the Pit of Despair, unless it opened from the Chamber of the Sacred Markers.

Interesting note about "The Crown of Queen Nzinga" though about Medusa's Lair opening up. I don't remember if the door opened at all or not, so I will need to go back and watch that episode again. But since we are talking about that episode, I remember someone suggesting that the Mine Shaft wall would've been locked during that run and the team would've been forced up into the Shrine. Hence, the reason why the temple spirit was in the tree close to the Swamp.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Ancient Warrior on December 24, 2011, 09:58:16 PM
As far as "The Crown of Queen Nzinga" goes, my guess is the team took the shortest route possible.  Not sure if they could've taken a separate route altogether if they started in the Crypt, but I doubt it would let them dodge all the guards or whatnot.  I'm really not sure about the rock wall being sealed, though; it's not the only time the Temple Spirit was in the stage-right tree and the players entered the Dark Forest from the room to its right. "The Bullet-Riddled Handbag of Belle Boyd" had that too, but the rock wall was still breakable.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on December 25, 2011, 12:59:01 AM
Just to throw a few more out there:

The Enormous Iron Nose Ring of Babe - During the temple rundown, you can see the half-pendant on the Observatory actuator. My guess is that Joel could've taken the top floor and beelined down the central column to the Laser Light Room. This is probably how he avoided a guard or two.

The Bonnet of Dolley Madison - Judging by the temple layout and guard layout, I bet the Laser Light Room would've been accessible during the run, and would've just forced the team up the central shaft.

The Mush Pot Hat of Johnny Appleseed - I am wondering if Chris took the bottom route, he would've avoided being taken out in the King's Storeroom. Its possible the bottom floor was an alternate path.

 The Melted Head of Madame Tussaud - Nick could've avoided most of the central shaft completely by climbing up to the King's Storeroom. This is evident when Jennifer runs to the King's Storeroom and bypasses two of the central shaft rooms.

The Upside-Down Compass of Henry Hudson - The frontrunner had no reason to run into the King's Storeroom, and it just served as a useless detour for the team. When Nick enters the temple, he goes into the Room of the Ancient Warriors from the Chamber.

The Golden Cup of Belshazzar - Okay, this run is weird because I somehow think that the Room of Harmonic Convergence was NOT a deadend. This is due to the fact on how brutal that deadend would've been and how we do hear a noise when Katherine tries all the steps. My guess is that both the Wheel Room and Troubled Bridge were accessible routes, but there was a production error in the Harmonic Convergence that forced Katherine onto the upper level. Also, the Treasure Room shouldn't have been a deadend either as you can hear the Treasure Chest making a noise when Katherine opens it up. I think her partner was just too stupid to bother looking down into it.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Silver Monkey on December 25, 2011, 01:08:10 AM
The Upside-Down Compass of Henry Hudson - The frontrunner had no reason to run into the King's Storeroom, and it just served as a useless detour for the team. When Nick enters the temple, he goes into the Room of the Ancient Warriors from the Chamber.

Derek, not Nick.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Ancient Warrior on December 25, 2011, 05:32:58 AM
The Golden Cup of Belshazzar - Okay, this run is weird because I somehow think that the Room of Harmonic Convergence was NOT a deadend. This is due to the fact on how brutal that deadend would've been and how we do hear a noise when Katherine tries all the steps. My guess is that both the Wheel Room and Troubled Bridge were accessible routes, but there was a production error in the Harmonic Convergence that forced Katherine onto the upper level. Also, the Treasure Room shouldn't have been a deadend either as you can hear the Treasure Chest making a noise when Katherine opens it up. I think her partner was just too stupid to bother looking down into it.

You know, I'd been thinking about this one for a while myself.  I do expect that the Treasure Room wasn't a dead end at all, but I'm really not sure what to make of the Room of the Harmonic Convergence.  That configuration could have been planned very early on, and there's a chance it might have been originally intended for Layout I, where the dead end would've only meant entering the Throne Room from the Wall Climb, then backtracking and choosing another path from the Wall Climb rather than from the very beginning.  In that context, not so bad, but if that's the case, the producers really should've thought things over a bit more before doing the run, since they had four more days to think about it...
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on December 31, 2011, 11:53:18 AM
The Mask of Shaka Zulu - The Treasure Chest was open, so I'm guessing Bobby was supposed to go up from the Holes of Python. However, I believe their was an alternative path from the Troubled bridge to the Observatory, and then into the Treasure Room, and around the horn of the temple. I believe the guards were in the Observatory and the Room of Three Torches.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: JCW555 on April 29, 2014, 12:56:11 PM
Sorry to bump an ANCIENT thread, but the run I'd like to point is the Ivory Hunting Horn of Roland. The reason I say this is that the half pendants was in the left hand column of markers in the Chamber of the Sacred Markers. Would Yakerra have been captured somewhere in the central shaft or in the Room of the Ancient Warriors, then Kraig would've had to go into the temple. This in mind, would you think something different in this run if this was to occur?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 03:30:06 PM
Yes there could've been an alternative path. Just like all the other runs stated above.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 04:25:11 PM
You know, that is a good point about the half-pendant location in the "Roland" run. After Yakerra knocks down the stone column, you can see the King's Storeroom door open at the top. My guess this layout would've been like a reverse "Useless Map" where starting at the top would've forced the team down the entire central shaft. Yakerra probably avoided a temple guard by not going up to the King's Storeroom at all. And avoided two time consuming rooms also. Instead, she avoided the direct path route and had an easier route instead. Runs like "Melted Head" and "Useless Map" would've played out the exact same way if the teams in those runs chose the floor opposite to that where the artifact was. Good observation.  ;)  :mrred:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 04:26:44 PM
Well, anyone could've come up with it. I mean, the same happened in Snow Cone and Poseidon. It's not THAT impressive.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 04:30:27 PM
Same with Benzibab. ;)

In Poseidon though, the upper doors were not open in the Pit when Kimberly knocked the stone column down. But the Chamber door open from the Tomb of the Headless Kings. This was even more strange than Roland and Snow Cone because it was like an entire new route was open. Would this route been a complete dead end like Bifocal Monocle? Or did Kimberly actually have an alternate (and more difficult) path to the artifact if she chose to go up? My guess is that a couple of the guards were in the central shaft.  :?:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 04:34:44 PM
I always had a feeling the three temple guards in Poseidon were in all the top rooms Kimberly never entered, ala Bifocal Moncole. Also, remember when Bandit Queen had the Pit-Chamber door opened? Not the most alternative route, but it was opened nonetheless.

Also, do you think Bullet Riddled Hand Bag counts as an alternative route? I mean, Leah could've avoided the King's Storeroom, and Matthew could've gone directly into the Shrine via the Quicksand Bog. Do you think that counts? I'm not sure on this one, I want to know what you think. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 04:43:35 PM
I am not sure how to label Belle Boyd. I don't really consider Matthew taking the Room of the Secret Password an alternate route because he missed a shortcut that created a longer path for him. Just like how we always point out how Chandra missed a shortcut in her temple run. ;) As for Leah, I definitely would say that the Chamber was an alternate path. By choosing the Chamber, she would've had an shorter path rather than taking the King's Storeroom. That's just how see it anyways.  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 04:48:45 PM
Yeah, there were A LOT of teams who lost because they didn't take shortcuts. Chandra, Retina, and James from Ponce de Leon are perfect examples of that. But both Leah and Matthew could've avoided the King's Storeroom altogether just to save time. Leah could've started the alternative route, and it would've been up to Matthew to follow up. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 04:54:28 PM
It was just like the Imperial Wizard run where Jared had to choose from the Chamber or King's Storeroom. In that run though, he picked the King's Storeroom which allowed him to take an easier path. Same idea with Leah and the King's Storeroom during the Belle Boyd run. So I would definitely consider the Chamber of the Sacred Markers an alternate path in Belle Boyd.

Also, I am surprised that no one mentioned Thornwood Gavel yet. In that run, Mike could've entered the King's Storeroom for a solo victory or enter the Tomb of the Headless Kings for a longer path. He chose the Headless Kings, which forced him to complete both that room and the Chamber. And then Kelli was a moron for taking the uncleared King's Storeroom. So in this case, BOTH contestants took both paths and it actually hurt them. Of course, Kelli was the one that entirely ruined this run by taking an alternate path. But Mike could've stayed high to get a solo victory too. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 04:59:21 PM
Definitely agree on Mystical Spellbook. And to add to that, Jared could've gone directly into the Quicksand Bog via the Shrine, like Katie did. Also, Jared could've entered the Chamber, meet a temple guard, then be removed in the Room of the Ancient Warriors altogether. I think THAT right there could've been an easier path. Since Katie was faster than Jared, she probably could've reached the Spellbook the way she was moving. Then we wouldn't have to worry about the guard in the Quicksand Bog. ;)

I agree about Thornwood Gavel, except for the solo victory part. Wasn't there a temple guard in the Room of the Secret Password? Unless that room was avoidable (which I don't think it was), then Kelli would've had to enter the temple no matter what. Regardless, Kelli pretty much screwed herself over with her poor planning. Otherwise, I agree that Thronwood Gavel was definitely another alternative path. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on April 29, 2014, 05:32:38 PM
Also, I am surprised that no one mentioned Thornwood Gavel yet. In that run, Mike could've entered the King's Storeroom for a solo victory or enter the Tomb of the Headless Kings for a longer path. He chose the Headless Kings, which forced him to complete both that room and the Chamber. And then Kelli was a moron for taking the uncleared King's Storeroom. So in this case, BOTH contestants took both paths and it actually hurt them. Of course, Kelli was the one that entirely ruined this run by taking an alternate path. But Mike could've stayed high to get a solo victory too. ;)

I agree about Thornwood Gavel, except for the solo victory part. Wasn't there a temple guard in the Room of the Secret Password? Unless that room was avoidable (which I don't think it was), then Kelli would've had to enter the temple no matter what. Regardless, Kelli pretty much screwed herself over with her poor planning. Otherwise, I agree that Thronwood Gavel was definitely another alternative path. ;)

The Secret Password was unavoidable in the Thornwood Gavel run. Neither the Dark Forest nor the Quicksand Bog opened from the Shrine. So regardless on which path Mike took, he would have encountered a guard before the Secret Password and would have been removed there. The best option for this team would have been for Mike to climb up to the King's Storeroom and have Kelli follow suit.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 06:45:26 PM
Yeah, that's what I thought. I knew there were some doors in the Shrine that were completely closed up. The alternative route would've been for Mike to go directly into the King's Storeroom, like PP4L mentioned above. This would've saved both players a lot of time. Same with Mystical Spellbook if Jared had either entered the Chamber, and possibly run into a guard in there, and be removed in the next room. That and/or Jared go directly into the Quicksand Bog from the Shrine. That's my observation at least. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 09:50:26 PM
You're both right about Thornwood Gavel. The Quicksand Bog door was locked from the Shrine. I remember a couple of people saying that it was open, but it was indeed locked. So Mike would've encountered both temple guards either way. Although Kelli should've reached the Gavel if she simply followed her partner's path and move faster. :roll:

And I agree that Jared should've entered the chamber in the Mystical Spellbook run. He was a fast player, but he stalled too much in some of the rooms of the temple. Especially in the Dark Forest. Katie should've been a frontrunner though and she would've been removed from the Quicksand Bog with a lot more time. And Jared shouldn't have a reason to screw around in the Dark Forest. They probably wouldn't have won because that layout was pretty hard.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 10:04:24 PM
Yeah, I agree. Katie definitely should've gone in first. And has Smashed Printing Plate been mentioned yet? If not, then that temple run had multiple doors open in the Pit too. If Jason had gone into the King's Storeroom, he could've run into a temple guard there, and then get taken out one room later, like I said about Mystical Spellbook. I hope this observation hasn't been mentioned yet. Correct me if I'm wrong though. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on April 29, 2014, 10:14:12 PM
I am guessing Smashed Printing Plate would've been a little like Belle Boyd where the King's Storeroom would've led down to the Chamber, It definitely would've been nice to see Jason taken out, but I am not sure if I wanted to see Dana in the temple at the same time. :roll:

Also, in Mary Shelley, Kate could've avoided the Chamber altogether and instead went straight into the King's Storeroom like Larry did. Kate also would've avoided a temple guard and we wouldn't have seen Larry in the Shrine. But Kate was still slow so I don't think they would've won either way.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on April 29, 2014, 10:24:30 PM
Yeah, Manuscript could've been a solo victory if Kate had avoided the Chamber. But then again, would you really want to see her assemble the monkey? For all we know, she could've been another Larry too. :roll: But yeah, they wouldn't have won even if it was a solo run.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 04, 2014, 06:37:41 PM
I just noticed that in the Golden Pepperoni run, the door to the Observatory from the Kings Storeroom opened. Maybe there was another path that required the contestants to go up the central shaft and then cross the top floor?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 04, 2014, 06:40:58 PM
That happened quite a bit in Season 2 if I remember correctly. That same door also opened in Silver Cannonball and in Icarus, but Amber and Jason unnecessarily detoured into that room. So that would be more of a dead end to me.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 05, 2014, 12:09:39 AM
That happened quite a bit in Season 2 if I remember correctly. That same door also opened in Silver Cannonball and in Icarus, but Amber and Jason unnecessarily detoured into that room. So that would be more of a dead end to me.

It also happened in the Charles Lindbergh run too. I think Kim even backtracks into the same room as Jason and Amber.  :oops:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 05, 2014, 12:44:59 AM
*Shudders* I think I've blocked that run out of my memory. :oops:

And since we were talking about it in the other thread, could Sacred Ring have been an alternative route as well? If the Shrine door DID open, then both Medusa's Lair (and obviously the Ledges) could've easily have been avoided. Then maybe Brian and Gracelyn would've had a shot at a solo victory. I know we don't actually see the Storeroom/Shrine door open, but I just thought I'd throw that in there anyways.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 05, 2014, 12:50:08 AM
*Shudders* I think I've blocked that run out of my memory. :oops:

And since we were talking about it in the other thread, could Sacred Ring have been an alternative route as well? If the Shrine door DID open, then both Medusa's Lair (and obviously the Ledges) could've easily have been avoided. Then maybe Brian and Gracelyn would've had a shot at a solo victory. I know we don't actually see the Storeroom/Shrine door open, but I just thought I'd throw that in there anyways.

We never get a good shot of the King's Storeroom-Shrine door in Sultan Suleiman. I watched that run a million times to see if we can see it open. The only reason why I think it should've opened because all the other Dark Forest runs had it open from that day. Both Captain John Smith and Missing Weather Maps from Season 2 anyways. And if Medusa's Lair was avoidable, then Brian and Gracelyn would've had the potential for a solo shot. But with Brian as a frontrunner, I don't see that happening. :oops:

And as much as I don't want to bring it up, I am pretty sure Golden Cricket Cage's temple run had an alternate path. The layout was exactly like Kamehameha's right down to the temple guard placement. Had John and Tia started in the Observatory, it probably would've been a solo shot. But that would be asinine to think they even had a chance.  :roll:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 05, 2014, 12:52:20 AM
Quote
But that would be asinine to think they even had a chance.
Unless the Purple Parrots made it to the temple instead and tried that route. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Red Jaguars Fan on May 05, 2014, 10:06:59 AM
*Shudders* I think I've blocked that run out of my memory. :oops:

And since we were talking about it in the other thread, could Sacred Ring have been an alternative route as well? If the Shrine door DID open, then both Medusa's Lair (and obviously the Ledges) could've easily have been avoided. Then maybe Brian and Gracelyn would've had a shot at a solo victory. I know we don't actually see the Storeroom/Shrine door open, but I just thought I'd throw that in there anyways.
I don't know if it helps much, but the Observatory/Lair door opened. It's usually that trick where the player goes for the middle door instead of down the stairs where the slab was. Also, Gracelyn never properly looked at the Shrine/Storeroom door despite what Kirk said. And Kirk can see if the door is open from his view point. It's most likely the Shrine door did open. If so... Gracelyn is an even bigger idiot than I thought.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 05, 2014, 10:22:26 AM
Although it's unlikely, there might have been a separate path that reqiured going down the central shaft and through the Swamp,  like a reverse Davy Crockett, but there most likely wasn't, and the girl was just being stupid.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 05, 2014, 04:00:58 PM
The whole central shaft path could've been possible, even the Missing Eye layout had the kids traversing down the central shaft. Of course, Michael and Emily were MUCH more competent than Brian and Gracelyn were. So maybe the Shrine door did open after all.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 05, 2014, 07:59:43 PM
For what it's worth, I don't think the Shrine opened from the King's Storeroom during the Sacred Ring of Sultan Suleiman run. A different sound effect goes off when the doors open from the King's Storeroom during this run in comparison with other Season 2 runs. I think the intended path was for the team to go down the central shaft and then across the bottom floor to the Dark Forest. This would leave the King's Storeroom as an extra, albeit unnecessary, room objective to complete (similar to Medusa's Lair space in a number of Season 2 episodes).
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 05, 2014, 10:24:02 PM
I like the idea of the Sultan Suleiman path forcing the team down the entire centeral shaft too. It would've been more unique than most of the Dark Forest paths on the show. And there is no way that Gracelyn would've missed the Shrine door opening too. It was not like the tiny door leading to the center of the temple that fooled some players like Shem and Jonathan from Battle Flag. So maybe Gracelyn was going in the right direction and the King's Storeroom was just a dead end?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 05, 2014, 11:28:51 PM
And then that begs the question, "What was meant to happen after Christina completed the King's Storeroom during the Secret Battle Plan of Nathan Hale run?" Was that another run where they were meant to descend down the central shaft and possibly avoid the King's Storeroom, or was the layout similar to Broken Wing of Icarus in that they were meant to head down from the King's Storeroom and then back up?

As much as I'd like to think that they were meant to go down from the King's Storeroom, the Crypt and Observatory guards were forced based on the way the temple layout appeared to be set up. Although there were some instances where all of the guard were forced during a 1.5 pendant run, I'm not sure that this was one of those instances.

Additionally, the camera angle in the Ledges and Kirk's commentary when James was in the Ledges makes me think that perhaps the bottom door to the Pit could have opened and created an alternate route straight along the bottom of the temple, a la Silver Horseshoe of Butch Cassidy, although I feel like this is a very unlikely scenario.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 06, 2014, 02:39:56 PM
I think the path that James and Christina took in Nathan Hale was their intended path. It seems unfair for a team with 1.5 pendants to encounter all three guards, but it happened in Missing Eye before and later in Lost Taj Mahal Turban. It is an example of the producers banking on the 1.5 pendant teams. All of this could've been avoided if Christina simply found her half-pendant. Not that it mattered, because she was so slow in the temple already. It would've been a loss anyways.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 06, 2014, 03:51:58 PM
Yeah, I also think the path the Battle Plan kids took was their intended path, like TRJ said. But their triple capture could've easily have been avoided if Christina had paid attention and actually found the half pendant.

Also, have we brought up Paintbrush and Stone Marker yet? If not, then that could've been an alternative path too. I mean, neither of those teams tried all three Gargoyle tongues, so maybe those top floor doors would've opened. And the teams wouldn't have gotten caught up in the Swamp/Bamboo Forest dead end. You never know. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 06, 2014, 11:51:35 PM
Both temple runs probably would've allowed access to the Trouble Bridge. But the Stone Marker team was more to be blamed for missing this opportunity. Keeli entered the Gargoyle Room as a frontrunner, and if she pressed all three tongues, then she probably would've been allowed to the Trouble Bridge. And with her quick speed, the Stone Marker run would've been more successful.

In Leonardo Da Vinci, Roberto was a second runner and Katie never entered the Gargoyle Room. I thought it was clever of him to try the top floor even with little time left. But he also failed to press all three tongues too. Not that it mattered, because he only had little time to do anything. And he almost pulled a Harriet Tubman by taking a different path.  :roll:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 06, 2014, 11:53:19 PM
But the Leonardo Da Vinci kids had 2 pendants. So even if there was a third guard in there, it wouldn't have mattered. ;)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 06, 2014, 11:54:11 PM
But the Leonardo Da Vinci kids had 2 pendants. So even if there was a third guard in there, it wouldn't have mattered. ;)

Oops, Katie and Robert did win two games in the temple. :P Keeli and Chris must've been the team with 1.5 pendants.  :mrred:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 06, 2014, 11:57:21 PM
Roberto you mean? ;)

And yes, Keeli and Chris did win 1.5 pendants in the temple games. Of course, the half pendant was nowhere in sight for them. But yeah, if both Keeli and Roberto had tried all three Gargoyle tongues in their respective runs, maybe they would've reached their artifacts at least.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 01:07:47 PM
Does anyone else think that in the Golden Goblet, the Dark Forest opened from the Jester's Court? When the girl completes the room you can hear the Dark Forest door sound effect. Maybe the wall wouldn't have been breakable like Alhambra/Theodora? Also, this run's layout was pretty difficult imo  :shock:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: JCW555 on May 17, 2014, 01:27:27 PM



^ Here's a snapshot from the run. I can't tell if the Dark Forest was opened or not.

Also I agree, this layout was one of the hardest IMO. I loved how she went up into the King's Storeroom though. They didn't do that much in season 2 if I recall correctly.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 17, 2014, 02:56:59 PM
Does anyone else think that in the Golden Goblet, the Dark Forest opened from the Jester's Court? When the girl completes the room you can hear the Dark Forest door sound effect. Maybe the wall wouldn't have been breakable like Alhambra/Theodora? Also, this run's layout was pretty difficult imo  :shock:

If we're going by sounds effects alone, then yes, the Dark Forest did open during the Golden Goblet run. By comparison, the low humming noise signaling the opening of the Dark Forest did not play during the Silk Sash of Mulan or Golden Pepperoni of Catherine de Medici runs, where we know the teams were able to enter the King's Storeroom. Still another sound effect played during the Missing Weather Maps of Charles Lindbergh run, where we also know the King's Storeroom opened but the Dark Forest did not.

As far as the intended path for Golden Goblet, I think that they would have been forced back upstairs either way. Given how runs from the same production day tended to share similar layouts and difficulties, it wouldn't surprise me. Take Silk Sash of Mulan, the run immediately prior, for example: Jessie and Steven had to go down the central shaft, up from the Jesters' Court to the King's Storeroom, and then back across the upper floor. Another thing I'd like to point out is that the half pendant for Golden Goblet was on the actuator from the Pit to Medusa's Lair, meaning that the Observatory was an extra room that did not need to be completed for this run.

And as for the temple guards for Golden Goblet, we know there was one in Medusa's Lair. The only unentered rooms were the Ledges, Dark Forest, and Secret Password. I suspect that the Ledges held a guard, since most Season 2 runs had a guard in one of the entrance rooms. Additionally, the upper left room never held a guard during Season 2, while the Dark Forest frequently did. For this reason, I believe the Dark Forest held a guard, meaning that that room was capable of being entered during the Golden Goblet run.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 03:30:02 PM
I honestly think the last guard(s) in Golden Goblet were in the Room of the Secret Password, and The Ledges. I know I'm alone on this, but I'm just not convinced at all that they would stick a temple guard in the Dark Forest. I know access was gained to the Dark Forest through the Shrine and the Jester's Court, but it would just serve as a pointless dead end to me. I think it was in the Ledges.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 04:29:05 PM
I agree that one of the guards was definitely in the Ledges, but as for the other one, I really don't know. The Secret Password area never head a guard in Season 2, and the Dark Forest had a guard frequently, but I think that if the guard was in the Dark Forest, the Kings Storeroom wouldnt have opened from the Jesters Court. I don't recall them having an extremely long path through the temple that could be done solo, but if the guard was in the Dark Forest, then the girl could have done it solo.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 17, 2014, 05:12:42 PM
I agree that one of the guards was definitely in the Ledges, but as for the other one, I really don't know. The Secret Password area never head a guard in Season 2, and the Dark Forest had a guard frequently, but I think that if the guard was in the Dark Forest, the Kings Storeroom wouldnt have opened from the Jesters Court. I don't recall them having an extremely long path through the temple that could be done solo, but if the guard was in the Dark Forest, then the girl could have done it solo.

I'm not sure what constitutes an "extremely long" path, but there were several instances of teams facing lengthy paths and being able to complete them as solo runs. Some successful ones include Lucky Pillow of Annie Taylor, Belly Button of Buddha, Star of Sultan Saladin, Very Tall Turban of Ahmed Baba, and Milk Bucket of Freydis. And Golden Earring of Henry Morgan, for one, could have been a solo run if Ashley avoided the Mineshaft (the door opened from the Shrine back to the Dark Forest, showing that was an option for Ashley), and her path still would have been pretty lengthy.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 05:25:20 PM
I meant when taking the difficulty of the rooms which need to be completed into account. In runs like Lucky Pillow and Buddha, the paths consisted of mostly easy rooms. But in the Golden Goblet, if a solo victory was possible, the path most likely was Medusa-Laser Light-Jesters Court-Storeroom-Shrine-Secret Password, and that path required the completion of quite a few time consuming rooms AND 3 floor switches, one of which would be via the elevator. I just don't think they would have a route this long to the artifact without having the frontrunner get taken out somewhere along it.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 06:57:53 PM
They could've put a temple guard in the Room of the Secret Password as a "one room away" trick. They certainly did that in Leopard Skin Cloak, taped immediately after Golden Goblet. Plus, I don't think the Mine Shaft opened (or would've opened) at all from the Shrine.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 17, 2014, 06:59:03 PM
They could've put a temple guard in the Room of the Secret Password as a "one room away" trick. They certainly did that in Leopard Skin Cloak, taped immediately after Golden Goblet. Plus, I don't think the Mine Shaft opened (or would've opened) at all from the Shrine.

Kirk even said at the end of the run that she was 2 rooms away, indicating that she was not going to be given direct access to the Mineshaft from the Shrine.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 17, 2014, 09:51:38 PM
They could've put a temple guard in the Room of the Secret Password as a "one room away" trick. They certainly did that in Leopard Skin Cloak, taped immediately after Golden Goblet. Plus, I don't think the Mine Shaft opened (or would've opened) at all from the Shrine.

Kirk even said at the end of the run that she was 2 rooms away, indicating that she was not going to be given direct access to the Mineshaft from the Shrine.

I do believe that Rachelle would've been forced to enter the Room of the Secret Password, but I only take what Kirk says with a grain of salt. I mean he did say that Elise should've slide down the to the Quicksand Bog during the War Fan run even though she didn't complete the Secret Password objective yet...

Anyways, I agree with the above two posts about Rachelle being forced to enter the Secret Password. The last temple guard had to be in that room because she entered pretty much every other temple room a long the path. So the three guards were in the Ledges, Medusa's Lair, and Secret Password. It would've been one of those runs where encountering all three guards would've helped. But Rachelle was way too slow to be a frontrunner. She wasn't bad, but she took too long doing certain stuff like climbing ladders and moving between rooms. She could've avoided the Observatory altogether too, similar to the Silk Sash run before it.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 09:57:16 PM
Yeah, I agree that running into all three temple guards would've helped. As long as Taylor picked up the half pendant, had he been given a chance in the temple. Rachelle could've started in the Ledges, then be forced up to the Crypt, and eventually get removed in Medusa's Lair. I'm not sure how much better Taylor would've done, but victory was slim anyways. Since this was a pretty hard layout.

And I definitely agree that the three temple guards were (or had to be), in the Ledges, Medusa's Lair, and the Room of the Secret Password.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 10:06:01 PM
Does anyone have other alternate route theories that they want to share?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot4Life on May 17, 2014, 10:11:05 PM
Yeah, I agree that running into all three temple guards would've helped. As long as Taylor picked up the half pendant, had he been given a chance in the temple. Rachelle could've started in the Ledges, then be forced up to the Crypt, and eventually get removed in Medusa's Lair. I'm not sure how much better Taylor would've done, but victory was slim anyways. Since this was a pretty hard layout.

But the half pendant was on the door leading to Medusa's Lair, while he would have gone into the Observatory if he were to have followed Rachelle's path. Therefore, he would have more likely than not passed by the half pendant.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 17, 2014, 10:12:24 PM
There was definitely an alternate path in Shaka Zulu. My theory was that this run was suppose to be like Leonardo Da Vinci and Stone Marker where Bobby would've been forced to enter the top floor. In Shaka Zulu though, the Holes of Python was NOT a dead end. If you watch the temple rundown, you can tell the Treasure Room chest was already open meaning that the Red Jaguars would've been forced up. So the correct path to the artifact was most likely through the top floor like in Trojan Horseshoe and the Map to the Lost Gold Mine. No way was Bobby's path the intended path. :?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 10:21:49 PM
Yeah, they would never make a layout THAT easy. It figures, the one time (besides Geronimo) the Treasure Chest is supposed to open, it's not used at all. It would've made for an interesting layout if Bobby and Brittany were to be forced up to the Treasure Room.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 10:36:23 PM
If only the production error hadn't happened. That passage should have been utilized more. Anywho, there had to have been an alternate path in Butch Cassidy. I'm guessing the Observatory would have been open and held a guard. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: JCW555 on May 17, 2014, 10:42:50 PM
As to the layout of the Mask of Shaka Zulu, I drew 2 possible routes:




Those are the two routes that I could think of.

The Red route seems more likely, but the orange one could also be likely.

I wouldn't know of any other possible routes in Silver Horseshoe of Butch Cassidy.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 10:43:31 PM
If only the production error hadn't happened. That passage should have been utilized more. Anywho, there had to have been an alternate path in Butch Cassidy. I'm guessing the Observatory would have been open and held a guard. Any thoughts?
One of the guards could've been in the Observatory. I don't know about an alternative route though.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 10:45:19 PM
If only the production error hadn't happened. That passage should have been utilized more. Anywho, there had to have been an alternate path in Butch Cassidy. I'm guessing the Observatory would have been open and held a guard. Any thoughts?
One of the guards could've been in the Observatory. I don't know about an alternative route though.
It would have been more of detour than a route, but I felt like mentioning anyways.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 10:48:35 PM
As to the layout of the Mask of Shaka Zulu, I drew 2 possible routes:




Those are the two routes that I could think of.

The Red route seems more likely, but the orange one could also be likely.

I wouldn't know of any other possible routes in Silver Horseshoe of Butch Cassidy.
The red seems like it would be the route, but who knows. There was also a theory that there was a route that went along the top of the temple and converged with the routes(s) you have on your image in the Treasure Room.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 10:49:15 PM
If only the production error hadn't happened. That passage should have been utilized more. Anywho, there had to have been an alternate path in Butch Cassidy. I'm guessing the Observatory would have been open and held a guard. Any thoughts?
One of the guards could've been in the Observatory. I don't know about an alternative route though.
It would have been more of detour than a route, but I felt like mentioning anyways.
Plus, there could've been a temple guard in the Crypt as well. And Paula could've very well have entered both the Crypt and the Observatory. So an alternative route could still be legit. But, still an interesting observation nonetheless.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 17, 2014, 10:49:44 PM
As to the layout of the Mask of Shaka Zulu, I drew 2 possible routes:




Those are the two routes that I could think of.

The Red route seems more likely, but the orange one could also be likely.

Judging from runs like Cobra Staff, Trojan Horseshoe, and Lost Gold Mine, I don't think the Shaka Zulu team would've been granted access to the Shrine-Tomb of the Ancient Kings. So I think they would've been forced to take the Well Bucket elevator. Same for Stone Marker and Leonardo Da Vinci if those teams made it far.

I also think that Bobby could've started in the Gargoyles and taken the Trouble Bridge too. The Cobra Staff run allowed for this freedom, and the Da Vinci and Stone Marker run would've allowed the same thing mostly likely if the players tried all three tongues in those runs. So basically, here are the two paths I see in Shaka Zulu:

1.) Gargoyles -> Troubled Bridge -> Observatory -> Treasure Room -> Shrine -> Torch Room -> Well -> Ancient Kings
2.) Cave if Sighs -> Wheel Room -> Throne Room -> Holes of Python -> Treasure Room -> Shrine -> Torch Room -> Well
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 17, 2014, 10:51:14 PM
I'm personally more interested in Silver Horseshoe's route. Where Paula could've entered more rooms, and then she wouldn't be as "amazing" as she is considered to be. Whether it would just be classified as a "detour" or not.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 17, 2014, 10:56:34 PM
I'm personally more interested in Silver Horseshoe's route. Where Paula could've entered more rooms, and then she wouldn't be as "amazing" as she is considered to be. Whether it would just be classified as a "detour" or not.

This one is hard to figure out like Shaka Zulu. I am interested whether Paula would've been allowed to enter any of the other top floor rooms. During her temple run, she did try the King's Storeroom door from the Heart Room but it did not open. What if Paula entered the Observatory then? Would she be allowed to enter the King's Storeroom from there? Maybe there would've been two routes to the artifact in that case. I think the path Paula took is the intended path the producers wanted her to take. If she started in the Observatory, then the run would be like Golden Stallion and Dead Man's Hand where only the bottom shaft door opens up to the left rooms of the temple. I think the guards were in these rooms:

-- Crypt (One of the guards had to be avoidable since she had one Pendant, so it had to be there.)
-- Observatory (Could be a "direct path" guard, like in Golden Stallion)
-- Dark Forest (encountered)
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on May 17, 2014, 11:01:47 PM
I'm convinced that there was a guard in the Crypt and Obserbatory. It would have mimicked the Babe the Ox layout. And someon said that the Kings Storeroom opening in the Belle Boyd run counted as an alternate path, so I guess the Observatory in Butch Cassidy would as well. This is pretty irrelevant, but the Throne/Pit door was open in this run as well.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: JCW555 on May 18, 2014, 12:09:00 AM



I can see 4 possible routes in Silver Horseshoe of Butch Cassidy (see image above).
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 18, 2014, 12:10:03 AM
Of course, we all know she won. But an alternative layout would've obviously have said otherwise.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on May 19, 2014, 11:24:22 PM
Do you guys think that there was an alternate with the Troubled Bridge in the Cosa Rara run? I am positive that the Troubled Bridge opened from the Observatory during that run. Some people don't seem to think so though. But I don't think the producers would've forced the team up the central shaft with that tough of a layout. I think Justin could've started in the Crypt for a Pecos Bill type layout.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Purple Parrots Fan on May 19, 2014, 11:32:04 PM
It could've been an alternative route. But then again, wasn't the half pendant on the Rock Quarry's avatar? Justin could've very well have been forced down into the Ledges. If not, Justin could've ran into his two temple guards in the Crypt and the King's Storeroom.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on June 01, 2014, 02:04:27 PM
This isn't really about alternate paths, but just the layout in general. In the Bent Shaving Pan Episode, I think only the Chamber opened from the Ancient Warriors. The sound effect that played when Irish activate the armor was the same one that played in Apanugpak and William the Conqueror when the Chamber door opened. I also compared the sound effect to the ones that played when the Storeroom opened from the Ancient Warriors (the only runs that fit this criteria were Me Linh and Bifocal Monocle) and the noise is different from the one in Bent Shaving Pan/Apanugpak/William the Conqueror. Just an interesting observation.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Viper on June 14, 2014, 06:59:07 PM
It could've been an alternative route. But then again, wasn't the half pendant on the Rock Quarry's avatar? Justin could've very well have been forced down into the Ledges. If not, Justin could've ran into his two temple guards in the Crypt and the King's Storeroom.
The Observatory/Troubled Bridge passage was definitely open, you can see it in the top left corner when Jessie is the Wheel Room. Similarly, the Observatory/Troubled Bridge passage was open in Leif Erikson, which means that Keely (i think it was her name) could have avoided the the dickish alternative path/dead end combo and a guard as well.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on June 16, 2014, 03:00:15 PM
I don't think Keeli actually turned the Sundial during the Stone Marker run. So it doesn't really show the Observatory-Bridge door opening. However, I do think that it would've opened though if she actually pushed all three tongues in the first place. I don't see the producers forcing the team up the central shaft and then taking a long path on the top floor. But then again, Season 1 also had ridiculous paths in the first place. Also, Roberto from Leonardo Da Vinci tried to do the same thing, but he never pressed all three tongues though. ;) But I agree, this layout was unfair from the start. It was even more cheap that Stone Marker's layout was identical to Leonardo Da Vinci.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: GreenMonkeys#1 on June 20, 2014, 12:43:50 PM
I just remembered that in Lost Love Letter, the Observatory door opened from the Storeroom which could possibly be convincing that the Throne Room & Medusa's Lair was avoidable and that Derrick could've made this a solo run.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on June 20, 2014, 03:27:39 PM
I just remembered that in Lost Love Letter, the Observatory door opened from the Storeroom which could possibly be convincing that the Throne Room & Medusa's Lair was avoidable and that Derrick could've made this a solo run.

The same thing also happened in the Grandy Nanny run too where the Observatory opened for the Orange Iguanas after they completed the King's Storeroom. Except there was no solo chance in that run.

I assume the Observatory would've opened for the Blue Barracudas in Stone Head too since that layout was almost identical to Captain John Smith. And Tony wouldn't have to worry about the four snakes Medusa's Lair at all. But Heather moved slow and Tony looked clueless anyways. So I am not sure if that run would've been any better. :roll:
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on July 29, 2020, 06:24:42 PM
Bumping this very old topic, but one run that was never mentioned was the Golden Chains run. During this run, BOTH the Wheel Room and Troubled Bridge paths opened. When Jennifer first entered the Cave of Sighs, she tried the wrong door to enter the Wheel Room. She tried to door that blocked by the Wheel instead of the door that had the ladder. When Justin later completes the Room of Harmonic Convergence, you can see the Wheel Room door open. If Jennifer used the right door and stood low the entire time, this would've been a solo win.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: Legends Explorer Alec on August 10, 2020, 12:45:06 PM
Also, if any of you get a minute, you can play this new temple run improvement game I made (http://phantomstemple.us.to/index.php?topic=3075.0).
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Silver Monkey on August 19, 2020, 02:22:24 PM
Just noticed that in the War Fan run, the door to the Dark Forest opened after Jeremy completed the Monkey. Admittedly it's possible that there could've been a temple spirit down there and/or the wall wouldn't break down like in Alhambra and Empress Theodora, but the possibility exists that this could've been a solo win.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on August 19, 2020, 07:54:35 PM
I want to say the last temple guard was hiding in the Dark Forest in the War Fan run. The only unentered rooms in that layout was the Ledges, Jester's Court (locked), and Dark Forest. I doubt the last guard was in the Ledges since they rarely put 2 temple guards in both entrance rooms except for "Sforza". The other guard could've been in the Ancient Warriors too similar to Discarded Seal and Chandragupta also. But with 1 Pendant, that would've been really cheap. Do we ever get a shot of the Dark Forest in the War Fan run? Sometimes you can see a tree limb raised if a Temple Spirit is in the Dark Forest.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot319 on August 20, 2020, 10:34:59 AM
The team in the War Fan episode also didn't enter the King's Storeroom. I haven't seen this run in a long time. Did any of the doors leading to that room open up? If not, then that room could be ruled out.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: The Red Jaguars on August 20, 2020, 09:55:49 PM
I rewatched the War Fan run on Youtube and none of the doors leading to the King' Storeroom opened. Some people on Youtube think the last guard was in the Ledges, making a double entrance temple guard encounter. I really doubt the temple guard was in the Ledges, although it's not impossible since the Sforza run had temple guards in both entrance rooms.
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: GreenMonkeys#1 on August 21, 2020, 12:58:50 AM
Remember that this was a one pendant run. The Dark Forest did open from the Shrine after Jeremy completed the Monkey. It’s logical that this could be where the other guard is. The only other place is in the other two armors in the Room of Ancient Warriors. That also hinges on whether the wall was breakable or not (see Alhambra and Empress Theodora runs).
Title: Re: Possible Alternative Routes
Post by: PurpleParrot319 on August 21, 2020, 07:56:55 PM
I think I remember thinking in the past that the final guard in the War Fan run was located in a wrong Ancient Warrior armor. King's Storeroom can be ruled out since apparently there was no way to access it. Jesters' Court gets ruled out too because there's never a guard there, it's a safe room. Given how many rooms had to be entered in this run, I think it's fairly safe to rule out the Ledges since one of the guards was in the other entrance room, the Crypt. Having two guards in the entrance rooms given what this layout ended up being would be really weird and doesn't make much sense to me. That leaves the Dark Forest and the other suits of armor in the Room of the Ancient Warriors that didn't get tried. Honestly, I really don't think the Dark Forest housed the final temple guard. I know it's possible, but unless the wall in this room couldn't be broken a la Alhambra and Empress Theodora runs and this room ended up being a trap dead end, I just think it's unlikely that the last temple guard was hiding in the Dark Forest. I see that room as being the correct choice after completing the Shrine of the Silver Monkey with the Room of the Secret Password being the wrong choice, similar to how Jeremy chose the wrong entry room at the start (and similar to several runs at that). So that leaves the Room of the Ancient Warriors. It's not unheard of for the wrong suit of armor to have a temple guard behind it. The Discarded Seal and Chandragupta runs had this, so it's highly likely that a guard was hiding in an incorrect armor. I think that was the case here, but we'll never know for sure, even after 25 years (that's crazy to think; man, we're all old, lol).